We are busy implementing OpenEMR multi-site for Home Based Care, Group Practice, Occupational Health, Cancer Screening and Retirement Village management.
The offsite portal is integral in our implementation as we are trying to encourage patient and physician interaction via the portal. However, we are experiencing some difficulties and issues which may be due to functionality limitations or bugs… We are unable to find the code or the documentation to differentiate. Can anyone in the OpenEMR project assist.
1: FORMS - There is an entry called FORMS but we are not sure as to which forms this relates. Is it possible to serve LBF other than Demographics.
2: DOCUMENTS - There is a sections called DOCUMENTS that relates to uploaded PDF files. We have found examples and uploaded them. On completion there are submitted and require signing and approval (when set server side). Documents appear in the offsite portal as authorised and signed but they do not appear to have any other function and we can not access them server side in the Pt record.
3: Offsite Portal serves CCR/CCD and Insurance information irrespective of Global settings server side…
4: The portal is a 3rd party web site external to our secure websites. We are experiencing resistance due to security concerns by patients that they are submitting and retrieving medical records via a 3rd party web site. Is there anyway that we can provide a level of comfort by wrapping the portal in our websites. The code would be protected but our patients would derive some comfort. We also need to have patients sign a waiver/disclaimer when using the portal.
5. One last thing. nothing to do directly with the offsite portal:
5.1 Is it possible to populate LBF fields with data from other LBF forms.
5.2 is it possible to create PDF forms that would be populated from OpenEMR and populate OpenMER. (Look like paper forms with fill and update capability).
5.3 Is it possible to have the patient report ignore blank fields when printing…
5.4 Is it possible to create groups in addition to Problems, Medications, etc. We catch vitals, nursing and SOAP notes. encounters on a daily basis. The CCR/CCD report has a date range, is it not possible to have the same for encounters
Your input and assistance is very much appreciated.
The original post from this morning is a fairly large post to tackle all of the questions asked during normal working hours on a weekday, especially with some of the east coast people recovering from Hurricane Sandy today. As OpenEMR is a community based project and a non-profit, we all contribute hours and work to this as our schedules allow.
Some posts may take some time for responses to be posted, it all depends on the user who is addressing the post’s schedule, and also if their capabilities are in that avenue of OpenEMR. Please be patient for a response, chances are one of the users on this board with sufficient knowledge of the Portal will answer your questions.
The forums are a very helpful tool in identifying any issues and bugs with the project, specifically due to user feedback. If we didn’t have these posts, users that don’t have a support package with a preferred vendor would be left without answers. So it really boils down to users, we (the OpenEMR users and developers) need these questions and feedback posted so that we can better improve the project.
I could not agree more as to what should happen, but the reality is something else!
The forum and its participants should not be the subject of unsolicited touting offering to answer questions in return for monies, or resolve bugs provided we agree to sponsor the work. Within minutes of posting, some outfit representing to be “OpenEMR development” named “CapMinds” was touting their services.
Our latest posting relates to the Offsite Portal, its functionality and bugs, and we are not sure as to your reference to working hours - unless you incorrectly assumed that the reference to lack of response from the developer referred to this particular posting.
With regard to the Offsite Portal, it is a brilliant addition to the OpenEMR system, but the lack of documentations and the fact that the source is closed, makes it very difficult to interact and contribute to its development. Perhaps ZHservices are not monitoring their email or SKYPE, or don’t have and spare time to address our enquiries, as we have been unable to obtain responses to our email, SKYPE and prior postings over the past three (3) months, hence this current posting which is addressed to “ALL” the community. Perhaps there lay the problem, “ALL” may be seen as an invitation to the touts in the community.
The last posting we made resulted in a slanging match between two contributors, whilst our queries remained unanswered. Once again, we appear to have provoked a reaction, but our queries remain unanswered. Someone commented recently on the fact that OpenEMR is downloaded on a regular basis but the interest is not reflected in the forum. If our experiences are anything to go by, people will be reluctant to chip in, fearing ridicule for their efforts.
Accordingly, we see no purpose or benefit of participating further in the forum and stand as an example of what happens to those that dare to do so.
Feel free to email myself with at brady@sparmy.com with your specific concerns. I’m a volunteer on the OpenEMR project and function as one of the project administrators, so would like to hear all of your specific concerns that have arisen (especially if you are receiving unsolicited messages) to avoid these things happening to future users.
Regarding ZH emails, they have been fixing several bugs in the patient portal demo lately (I know this because I have placed several of their fixes in the 4.1.1 patches) and I do recall that we were all corresponding emails with each other; please feel free to continue ccing me on those emails. Hopefully they will reply to your initial forum post.
Regarding the touting between contributors; I know the thread you are referring to and apologize for the unprofessional behavior of those contributors (hopefully the potential loss of a valued user will change their behavior).
Please do note this is an open source project which is comprised of of a variety of volunteers, developers, vendors and companies all with a wide array of plans and motivations. One of the goals of the community is to maintain a spirit of openness, kindness and cooperation. Occasionally, even with the best intentions, things will go awry.
The offsite portal itself is Closed source! So no one except for ZH has source code. That was one point I attempted to convey previously. This is a fact that is unlikely to change. As a result your issue number 4 on security is going to be next to impossible to address.
There is a separate onsite portal component to OpenEMR whose source code IS available (you already have it as part of a normal install). It does not have the sophistication that the offsite portal does, but security would be fully within your control and you can inspect how things work for yourself.
While not pleasant, I stand by my statements in the previous thread as facts.
There is no way that they can give you the code to run on your server and keep it closed source.
If they gave you the code to run on your server, according to the open source license, they would need to release the code as open source.
By serving the code on their website and not distributing it, they are exploiting a “loophole” in the open source license.
I’m not crazy about this loophole and honestly I don’t think it is ethical. They are taking advantage of the open source efforts of others who do contribute their code, and they are making money as a result of this. However, they are not doing the same back. I know that they are making their portal “free”, but truly in the nature of open source they should be contributing the code to the project.
Now, at some point, someone is going to need to duplicate their work to further develop the portal in the OpenEMR code. This is a shame.
They are taking advantage of the open source efforts of others who do contribute their code, and they are making money as a result of this. However, they are not doing the same back.
The new GUI took OpenEMR to another level. If not for ZH’s work on this, we would still have “a GUI only a mother could love” (in the parlance of Dr. Bowen)
Yehster has mentioned pooling resources for development of new features. From the number of users I see here on this forum, there are enough folks to make this cost effective.
What wold a portal mentioned in this thread cost to develop? Let’s have a number and then pool our resources to get this done.
They are taking advantage of the open source efforts of others who do contribute their code, and they are making money as a result of this. However, they are not doing the same back.
The new GUI took OpenEMR to another level. If not for ZH’s work on this, we would still have “a GUI only a mother could love” (in the parlance of Dr. Bowen)
Yehster has mentioned pooling resources for development of new features. From the number of users I see here on this forum, there are enough folks to make this cost effective.
What would a portal mentioned in this thread cost to develop? Let’s have a number and then pool our resources to get this done.
Because the Offsite Portal is a separate component, chances are it doesn’t use GPL’d code directly, even though it does interface with the rest of OpenEMR. As such, ZH *is* entitled to keep that code closed source. (Again something I’m repeating from the other thread.)
This would be similar to a scenario where I wrote a module that interfaced with LibreOffice (which is GPL) through it’s published API’s. I wouldn’t be relying on GPL source code directly, even though I’m using GPL software. My new module would not be subject to the GPL, because it’s not a derived from LibreOffice even though it depends on it. I would legally be free to keep that module closed source.
The “software as service” loophole is definitely addressed as part of GPL3 and you are still required to make source code available even if you aren’t distributing the software itself. However, the offsite portal isn’t derivative. It’s “original” work so to speak. I don’t like the fact that they are keeping the Offsite Portal closed source, but I acknowledge that it isn’t a violation of the GPL to do so.
Wow!! Never realized there was so much of discussion going on about the portal. Nice to know that there is interest in the offsite portal. I wasn’t monitoring the forum precisely because of the reasons that I will state in the last part of this message.
But before that:
The offsite portal was created with a specific objective that will meet our company’s goals. We are offering it as a free service and it is working for the providers who are using it. People have never had trouble contacting me. If you call 571-766-8074 I personally answer the call, always have.
Folks who want to customize are having the option to do so. That is why the onsite portal was developed and promoted. The offsite portal has code that are not open source and licensed by us to use on our servers. The code itself in the portal is entirely written by us.
As Brady mentioned we fixed the issues that were brought to our attention. This issue was caused by a code change in the OpenEMR code base. We submitted the patch for the same. Last week we noticed that it was broken again because of another code change in the OpenEMR code base. We will submit the fix for that as well.
We have posted several videos which we thought would be adequate for people to work with the portal. Obviously they are not. So I am going to setup a webinar session for folks who need further clarification. Whoever wants to join can email me their interest. sam@zhservices.com Even if there is only one person interested I will hold the session. Hope this will help. I will try to record this session and post it on youtube as well.
Regarding the behavior here is what I have to say: there should be a level of respect in interacting or commenting about other people and their work. People are volunteers and they don’t get paid. A spirit of cooperation is essential if you have to pull a team together. What I cannot figure out is why is there so much animosity? Why denigrate others? Can we not convey our idea with more dignity?
I have been a user of OpenEMR for a year now and I have to say that by judging from the posts of other users they want the Golden Eggs and don’t want to feed the Goose. And sometimes also want the Goose.
Listen, this isn’t pure communism… there has to be a line drawn where supporters of the project can make money through free enterprise. I am all up for companies such as ZH to create such a remarkable plugin and have us use it for FREE! What else do you want!? You complain that they aren’t releasing the source code… well that’s their choice! Hell, with all of your complaining they should charge you for using it.
If project developers don’t make money off of their endeavors then they go out of business. If they go out of business then there will be no one left to continue to enhance the software.
Personally, I feel that OpenEMR is being used by a bunch of hippies who were given a car and then complain that the gas should be given to them for free too.
So far I have one person who has emailed me directly to join the webinar session. I am planning to have that session towards the middle of next week at about 1:00 PM EST. If there are any others please contact me directly. Gotomeeting has provision for 16 participants in a session.
I wasn’t monitoring the forum precisely because of the reasons that I will state in the last part of this message.
(from Shameem)
Please don’t do that. Really important to monitor these forums, let me know if you need me to state the reasons
NUMBER TWO
Are vendors/professionals sending unsolicited private messages to users that post on these forums? This seemed to be one of the main upsetting points of the original poster in this thread. Is this acceptable or should we request vendors not do this do be allowed to post their services on the OpenEMR Professional Support page?
NUMBER THREE
I suggest that we all be professional and maintain a spirit of openness, kindness and cooperation. OpenEMR has a diverse ecosystem of users/developers/vendors/professionals/“hippies” with different goals/objectives/philosophies and varying degrees of contributions. If the community agrees, is this something that we should consider explicitly typing up and placing on the wiki? None of us are immune to making these type of mistakes (I still feel bad about bashing a developer several years back for making mistakes in the sql-upgrade script…), but note the one example of unprofessional behavior referred to by the original poster in this thread has contributed to the putting off of one user and one major contributor from using these forums.
As promised here is the credentials for the meeting. So far I have only Alfonzo who showed interest. Hoping that others will come too.
1. Please join my meeting, Wednesday, November 07, 2012 at 11:00 AM Eastern Standard Time. https://www1.gotomeeting.com/join/284609192
2. Use your microphone and speakers (VoIP) - a headset is recommended. Or, call in using your telephone.
Dial +1 (404) 891-0552
Access Code: 284-609-192
Audio PIN: Shown after joining the meeting
Meeting ID: 284-609-192
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